Jivanjee and the Hultgreen Syndrome
Affirmative action was outlawed in California when two thirds of California voters passed Proposition 209, so it’s now the law of the land in every state as well as federal law. Because the Supreme Court and federal courts have dragged their feet [a federal judge held up implementation in California by claiming “the voters didn’t know what they were voting for”, until the appeals court came to its senses and slapped him across the head] so much and so long that it’s alive and well in most of the country, and in most of the military services.
Professor Lynn estimates that the average IQ of India is 83, too low to sustain a technological society. jivanjee has a 99.9% probability of having been patently unqualified to be a pilot and was accepted to flight school only because of affirmative action. Political correctness will prevent anyone in the military, particularly his own trainers, from acknowledging that he was never qualified to be admitted in the first place, simply unqualified to fly, and is solely responsible for killing himself, discrediting Hamilton who might have actually been a highly qualified pilot, and destroying $83 million worth of U.S. government property.
“The report noted Jivanjee passed too close to another jet in a
training flight the day before the collision, an incident that wasn't reported
to commanders.”
Political correctness at its finest: shouldn’t this tendency to destroy so much military hardware ourselves be referred to as the Hultgreen Syndrome?
AF:
Pilots Caused Fatal F-15 Collision
August 26, 2008
Associated Press
PENSACOLA, Fla. - Two inexperienced F-15C Eagle pilots made
errors that caused a fatal mid-air collision during a combat training mission
over the Gulf of Mexico, Air Force investigators concluded in a report released
Aug. 25.
Both pilots misjudged how close they were to each other and had
less than two seconds to react before Capt. Tucker Hamilton's wing sliced into
1st Lt. Ali Jivanjee's cockpit in the Feb. 20 accident, investigators said.
"The cause of this mishap was pilot error. Both men failed
to clear their flight paths and did not recognize their impending high-aspect,
mid-air collision," said Brig. Gen. Joseph Reynes, the head of the seven-member
Air Force Accident Investigation Board.
Jivanjee, 26, of San Dimas, Calif., died instantly. Hamilton,
who is now assigned to a non-flying position in Germany, ejected with minor
injuries.
The single-seat fighter planes were destroyed - an $83 million
loss for the Air Force.
Both men had excellent qualifications and flying records, Reynes
said.
"They were doing maneuvers we do every day thousands of
times in all of our air combat command flying aircraft," he said.
The report said both pilots did not have enough time flying the
F-15 to be experienced in the aircraft. Jivanjee had fewer than 120 hours of
flight time in the aircraft and Hamilton had flown it just under the required
500 hours, the report said.
The report noted Jivanjee passed too close to another jet in a
training flight the day before the collision, an incident that wasn't reported
to commanders.
"It was a different set of circumstances, but it opens the
question of whether Jivanjee totally understood those closure moments,"
Reynes said, referring to the final moments when the planes passed each other.
Investigators said they found no mechanical or structural
problems in the two, nearly 30-year-old fighter jets, which were part of the
Air Force's aging and problem-plagued F-15 fleet. The 1979 and 1981 F-15s flown
by the two Eglin Air Force Base pilots were in good condition, Reynes said.
The Air Force largely grounded its F-15 fleet from Nov. 3, 2007,
to Jan. 10 after an F-15 broke apart in mid-air over Missouri. An investigation
found that 160 of the Air Force's nearly 700 F-15s had defects. Last month,
another F-15 crashed and killed one pilot during a training mission over the
Nevada desert.
The two pilots missed critical training flights in the two
months the fleet was grounded, yet the investigative board could not conclude
the missed training led to the crash because both met all the qualifications to
fly, Reynes said.
"They were both competent and proficient. Were they has
proficient as they could have been had we kept flying for the last three
months? I cannot answer that, but it does pull at your heart and your
mind," he said.
© Copyright 2008 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This
material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
Add Your Comment:
·
Aug 26, 2008 7:57:42 AM
The surviving pilot
should be reduced in rank to 2nd Lt and sent to logistics school for training
as an logistics officer, then shipped to Thule Greenland to count the trees.
Aug 26, 2008 8:22:30 AM
Purple,
I'm sure the pilot already is being punished just by the fact he has to live
with what happened.
God Bless both the pilots.
Aug 26, 2008 8:38:41 AM
Well this one is full
of, would have, should have, could have's. A rather unremarkable story of a
mid-air. I never like to hear about any aviator injured or killed, flying is
hazardous, we were told that from day one of flight training. Without the
flight time in type, comes problems. Getting the flight time in type, can cause
problems. That experience requirement, goes for everyone that either works on
these birds or fly's them. Somebody had to sign their log books that allowed
them to move up to operating this equipment. At the velocities that this A/C is
capable of, every second of off set is a 6 mile error in heading. 12 miles of
separation suddenly becomes no miles of separation. The usual blame game is not
going to help the family of the aviator who lost his life. May God rest his
sole.
·
15219629
Aug 26, 2008 10:10:45 AM
Everone has heard the
old saying that "Aviation in itself is not dangerous but it is very
unforgiving of mistakes."
As long as we attempt to do things, anything, we will make mistakes and have
accidents. As ususal, all any of us can do is make note, learn and continue to
march.
My heart goes out to the families of these fine aviators and all who knew them.
There have been those that have gone before them, and unfortunately, there will
be some to follow. What is the point to deny the inevitable, even though we
strive daily to prevent it from occuring? We as humans make errors and these
leak to catastrophic mistakes such as this one.
It is bad to be lost in combat and to be lost in training is a tragic because
of it's avoidability. It is a risk we have all taken. Our military must keep up
the pace and not withdraw realistic training because of fear of loss. That
"training" is what makes those that defend this great nation the very
best military in the world.
R.I.P. & God bless and Protect them all.
JD
·
AceShaw
Aug 26, 2008 10:18:12 AM
I agree with you 100%
JP8VaporHead-
I just couldn't imagine having to go around knowing that a simple little
mistake took a young man's life.
Aug 26, 2008 10:45:57 AM
Hey purplesuiter you
ever serve in the military or ar you a want-to-be....typical blame the survivor
stuff. Just because the Capt.'s wing sliced into the Lt's cockpit does not make
him at fault. We learn and can teach others from our mistakes...he should be
allowed to continue flying as long as he is willing and can maintain his
proficiency and his combat edge, in fact he would likely be one of the most
cautious flyers after this. REMEMBER both of these brave guys VOLUNTEERED to
defend this great country...I don’t think that Jivanjee would want Hamilton to
stop flying over this.
God Bless both of these men and their families.
Aug 26, 2008 11:03:43 AM
i agree both pilots made
mistakes just because one survived doesnt make him the evil guy...he has to
live with that forever...i get sick of situations like these, typical idiotic
people blaming the survivor....this was a fatal mistake and it happened, so
drink some prune juice and let that sht go
Aug 26, 2008 11:20:57 AM
Purplesuiter,
It must be great to have served 20 without ever making a mistake. Yes, this
mistake cost a man's life. But, a mistake is a mistake. I'm sure he will grieve
over this forever. I don't know what you did in the Air Force, but I know what
I did in the Navy and on the Detroit PD. Trust me, I made errors in judgement.
Split second decisions while under stress and sleep deprived. I have incidents
that I have been and will continue to live with for the rest of my life. Try
not to be so judgemental, it isn't very becoming of a veteran toward another
veteran.
On another note, again I wish to extend my sincere sympathies and prayers to
the family and friends of the deceased pilot, Ali Jivanjee as well to Capt.
Hamilton. He has much to deal with and will need support.
·
ldruley
Aug 26, 2008 12:17:26 PM
Training accident! It is
a great shame. But, it sometimes happens. I am sure neither men got up this
morning planning to crash. My best to both families and as far as the cost of
the planes. Oh well, we lost a fine young man and another has to live with the
memories. CSM Ruley
Aug 26, 2008 12:58:01 PM
Poorly written article.
The article says, "Both men had excellent qualifications and flying
records". Then the articles says,
"The report said both pilots did not have enough time flying the F-15 to
be experienced in the aircraft. Jivanjee had fewer than 120 hours of flight
time in the aircraft and Hamilton had flown it just under the required 500
hours, the report said."
Then another reversal,""They were both competent and
proficient."
Well what is it, were they both competent and proficient or were they
inexperienced?
Aug 26, 2008 1:45:48 PM
if your father and
grandfather are admirals, you can crash or get shot down in FIVE jets...as
mccain has done in his naval career.
Aug 26, 2008 1:57:55 PM
Tuffgrunt.
They were both accomplished pilots, just not in the F-15.
Aug 26, 2008 2:00:48 PM
Bonfire that's pretty
bad taste.
Mcain was shot down putting his life on the line for his country.
he may have wrecked some planes in traing but I don't think he caused any
deaths.
Aug 26, 2008 2:06:50 PM
Bonfire,
I'm sure you're a honorable man,but politics has no place on this thread.
Donnie Burke, AMS3
VAW-121, 1976-79
Aug 26, 2008 9:27:01 PM
bonfire is just
repeating the oft spoken democrat talking points about how McCain was
responsible for the fire aboard an aircraft carrier he was serving on.
Aug 27, 2008 12:06:18 AM
Purplesuiter,
You and that Bonfire are both so full of crap. Neither of you know what you are
talking about. John McCain had nothing to do with the USS Forestall fire nor
did he crash all the planes you speak of. Your both a couple of dueche bags for
even discussing such a thing on this thread as well as being flat out wrong.
It's amazing how much stupidity is on the military.com website.
Aug 27, 2008 2:08:24 AM
Saw 2 F-14's go down
witin 2 days,was first on scene on second plane,both crew members were still
alive,can't even describe what I saw in words.Then in July '76,watched in shock
as a Blue Angle flew his A-4 into the ground while upside down,there was a fire
a mile long.
Aug 27, 2008 2:56:45 AM
rkgtactical
All I said what the the other guy was just repeating the democrat talking
points.
I know that McCain was not responsible for the fire aboard the carrier.
·
cdrhagen
Aug 27, 2008 8:04:02 AM
It is becoming
increasingly obvious to me that very few of you can have the faintest clue
about air combat warfare and the training required to be proficient in a
fighter jet. There have allways been, and will allways continue to be mid-air
collisions during training with fighters flown by man. Desk job in Germany?
Counting trees at Thule? That's like shoveling **** in Louisiana! In my Air
Force he would have been back in the air in a heart-beat focusing on confidence
building and staying combat ready. For those of us who missed our friends with
a few inches, - not once, but many times,- an accident like this one brings
back memories of that rush of adrenaline and candid debriefings from which we
all learned a lot. Accident investigation boards should be abolished in the
form they have today....."The Force is shot to hell!"
A fine man is dead and a flyboy needs support! So do their families and loved
ones.....
With a less punitive system the fighting power of your nation would increase.
Aug 27, 2008 8:26:17 AM
cdrhagen wrote:
"With a less punitive system the fighting power of your nation would increase.
"
So....if a pilot is negligent in doing a task in his job, which results in the
death of someone else, you think there should be no punishment? Need
accountability..........
Aug 27, 2008 9:51:41 AM
Fighter lead in training
is not what it used to be at Holloman AFB. Now AETC pretends to teach BFM to
T-38 students but it is not real aggressive and does not emphasise geometry and
situation awareness as well as closure and six axis manuvering. It is awful
that an F-15 Driver is doing one v one BFM and collides but it has happened
before.
These men were let down but the ASir Force Training system
·
7747278
Aug 27, 2008 10:48:23 AM
midair collisions will
unfortunately continue to happen. pilots with little experience need more air
time before they are allowed to do more complex manuvers. too much sim time i
think. while stationed at an air station, i saw one happen. made me sick to the
stomach,and these were prop jobs (training station). until our services come up
with something that can move an aircraft away from a collision. we will just
see more.
Docsenko
·
ex3rdmp
Aug 27, 2008 11:07:55 AM
Bonfire is an idiot.
Somebody ban him so we can have some sense on this board. I bet he isn't even a
vet. He is just one of the paid bloggers working out of the DNC camp. Yes
people, they have paid employee's whose entire job is to go on sites like this
and attack the opponent. The crazier the attacks the better.
·
ex3rdmp
Aug 27, 2008 11:11:44 AM
"So....if a pilot
is negligent in doing a task in his job, which results in the death of someone
else, you think there should be no punishment? Need accountability..........
"
There is negligence (like striking a gondola wire while hot dogging in the
Italian Alps) and there is an accident like flying too close in training. One
should be actionable and the other should not. In order to have realistic
training we will always have accidents but people's careers should not be over
just because they made an accident in training.
·
cdrhagen
Aug 27, 2008 12:10:37 PM
Hi JP8VaporHead,
All your fine men in uniform are concidered aces untill proven otherwise,-and
in this case there is nothing in the article telling me why they hit. What kind
of maneuvering was it? What were the mission objectives? BFM, ACM, or something
else on the annual training program? Or was it weapons testing/training? What
was the nature of the problems leading up to the pilot error alledgedly made?
If you want zero eccidents, you might just as well bolt your F-15's to the
tarmac. No guts,- no glory! Stop looking at the Squadron building as a
Court-room. It is a room for fighter-boys.....and if you cannot accept that,
then stop breeding them. Fighter operations is a delicate ballance between
being agressive and carefull. When you are making that balancing act your
profession, you are bound to make an error or two,- sooner or later. If you
then live to fight another day, that chance to fly again should not be taken
away from you by default! That was all!
Aug 27, 2008 12:43:43 PM
I was not saying the
pilot in this story needed to be punished, if you read my first comment at the
beginning.
I've read the final accident report already. The pilots were doing BFM's.
·
JiminGA
Aug 27, 2008 3:04:07 PM
It's a dangerous job and
humans make mistakes that are sometimes fatal.
Aug 27, 2008 7:25:27 PM
TuffGrunt77:
The AF definition of a fighter pilot that is clssified as
"EXPERIENCED" is 500 hours in that specific weapons system if he/she
has never been "experinced" in another "type" system. In
this case, both pilots were initial F-15 pilots from pilot training. Neither
had over 500 hours in the F-15, thus they were officially classified as
"INEXPERINECED" in their weapons system (F-15) It is just a number.
If an Experienced pilot in one a/c transitions to a differenct a/c..say a
change from an F-4 to an F-16, then only 300 hours in the F-16 classifies that
pilot as EXPERIENCED in the F-16. Make sense?
Aug 28, 2008 3:33:40 AM
Purple,
I just wanna say, I'm really surprised by your military.com profile. Never, in
the time that I've been in the Air Force, have I met or seen a retired TSgt
with an empty profile and only 2 ribbons. I'm not going to assume or say
anything negative about your career except for wow, just wow..........
Aug 28, 2008 1:05:42 PM
Duck:
Thanks for clarifying the point about the standards regarding the pilots'
experience status.
Aug 31, 2008 5:59:34 AM
"chops"
I never found to the time to finishing my bio.
Seen or heard the ghosts at the Kun? You did hear the stories about the one
hangar there.
·
18167737
Sep 1, 2008 3:19:43 PM
Purplesuiter,
You knack for stupidity amazes me. You sound like some flunkie that spent a lot
of time on kp or mess duty.
Sep 4, 2008 5:37:57 PM
Purple,
You are an IDIOT!
Lt Col Stephen Cobb (Ret)
·
18844698
Sep 4, 2008 6:35:12 PM
What is it that you did
do purple? Polish knobs?
Sep 4, 2008 6:37:49 PM
Fighter pilot Training
is and always will be a dangerous thing but it is necessary if we are to
maintain our country. My condolances to the family and to the survivor. I don't
think a day will ever go by that he wont remember this. If there is negligence
then that has to be taken care of but the witch hunts that have occured and are
becoming ever more prevalent need to stop. They serve no purpose and only serve
to damage our great military.If you read the report you will find one of the
contributing factors is a shortage of flight training hours complicated by a
fleet wide aircraft problem.
Jim Wright
Sep 4, 2008 6:39:57 PM
Fighter pilot Training
is and always will be a dangerous thing but it is necessary if we are to
maintain our country. My condolances to the family and to the survivor. I don't
think a day will ever go by that he wont remember this. If there is negligence
then that has to be taken care of but the witch hunts that have occured and are
becoming ever more prevalent need to stop. They serve no purpose and only serve
to damage our great military.If you read the report you will find one of the
contributing factors is a shortage of flight training hours complicated by a
fleet wide aircraft problem.
Jim Wright
·
11924074
Sep 4, 2008 6:59:27 PM
I also do not like the
wording of this article and think the author should be ashamed. Perhaps the
author does not understand the experience level needed before reaching a major
weapon system plane.
Flying a fighter is not the same as other planes - fighter pilots may only
receive a quarter of the hours of other pilots after 20 years of service. This
does not mean that they are less experienced. These pilots underwent multiple
years of pilot training before even stepping foot into the cockpit of the F-15.
All of this training was preparing them for the fighter - learning tactics and
operating procedures, memorizing emergency procedures, and practicing in
simulators. Gaining actual flight hours in this plane is difficult as they can
go through 6,000 lbs. of fuel in one hour and the physical demand of pulling
multiple G's is straining. In order to fly this plane, these men WERE
experienced.
Every day these men were training for war and training to protect our country.
Doing this job means that, even though it is training, there is still a lot of
risk. As eyesight01 said, reaction time is extremely limited. These men have to
react and, when something goes wrong, have less than seconds to respond. It is
the unfortunate situation when a person's life is lost in training, but I can
guarantee that these men were properly trained.
The aftermath of an accident causes a lot of should have, could have, and what
if's. The situation of this occurring immediately following the extended grounding
of the planes leaves questions that can never be answered; however, I do know
that during this grounding, these men were still studying and training -
finding simulator time and going through tactics and procedures in classrooms.
"Inexperienced" should never have been used to describe these pilots.
Both men dedicated their lives to serving our great country and deserve a
higher level of dignity.
·
5992569
Sep 4, 2008 7:00:15 PM
I spent 25 years flying
AF jets from F-100s to F-16s. The safe way to fly fighters is to keep them in
the hanger. Flying fighters is dangerous. Pilots who are reckless don't make it
out of pilot training. The workload for a fighter pilot is heavy. He or she is
the pilot, weapon systems operator, navigator and flight engineer. One mistake
can be tragic. Pilots try to avoid those mistakes. I can assure you that
misconduct was not a factor. Two professionals were doing their jobs. After
some retraining, I hope they return the pilot to flying status.
Colonel Gene McVay, author of TOP GUN MANAGEMENT and Publisher of
arkansasbeat.com
·
16543248
Sep 4, 2008 7:19:47 PM
As a surgeon, I can
assure you that every surgeon knows of a mistake he/she made which cost another
human being their life. Very few stop operating as a result of this knowledge.
This is due to the long selection process to become a surgeon. I believe the
same is true for fighter pilots. That's the nature of the job and sometimes a
mistake results in killing your colleague or even yourself.
·
11693995
Sep 4, 2008 7:30:50 PM
Dear Purplesuiter,
The surviving pilot is now in a non-flying position, which is worse than a
downgrade in a rank to a pilot. Also, it states above that the deceased pilot
had recently flown too close to another aircraft in training (and was likely
struggling with maintaining appropriate distance). Hamilton was likely not the
sole pilot at fault and will have to live with the memory of what happened.
Please respect his service to this country and the memory of his fellow wingman.
·
18090321
Sep 4, 2008 7:33:13 PM
what was jivanjee's
religious affiliation?
Sep 4, 2008 8:09:12 PM
How sad these pilots lost
their focus if only for a second. However, as long a man fly's he will stumble
once in a while. The families of both should remain proud of their airmen.
·
8860907
Sep 4, 2008 8:36:52 PM
Pilot error happens, We
learn from our mistakes and improve on them. Mc Cain was shot down in Vietnam,
and served time in a POW camp, I believe it was Hanoi Hilton 4 or 5 years. On
the carrier he was sitting in his jet near a jet that shot off a missle
accidently and hit a jet across the deck. The fire and explosions started, and
chaos ensued. Acft and lives were envolved from the incident. Mc Cain was
sitting in his acft when this happened, he was not the cause of the mishap.
·
8389293
Sep 4, 2008 8:53:04 PM
Having been lucky enough
to spend 30 years as an Air Force Flight Surgeon, and again lucky that most of
it was as the GIB in the Eagle and the Viper, it is easy to separate those who
have "been there" and those who do not have a ****in clue.
·
2240885
Sep 4, 2008 8:57:39 PM
eyesight01, 15219629,
and all comments of similar verbage appear to have their heads and their
hearts, their training and experience in order. My father was one of the early
test pilots and, in his spare time did things like establish the nutritional
standards for high-altitude pilots, re-wrote the ADC books for safety reasons.
He pulled a lot of body parts out of planes in the early days and spent time
with widows with babies, as did my mother. He was a hell of a pilot, an
officer, a gentleman. One thing that troubled him were instructors who pushed
the pilots too early. The article is despicable and painful to read, and the
punishment of the surviving pilot is beyond my comprehension. If Dad were
alive, I am certain he would have written a comment similar to eyesight01. He
had a quiet eloquence with words because he was a great pilot and a great human
being. Meaning he was a fly-boy, but a sober humanitarian first. May God lift
the wings of those who are suffering, those who believe they need not take
responsibility and point fingers ridiculously, due this, indeed,
"unremarkable" mid-air collision tragedy. May God lift the souls of
all, family members and friends.
·
14454774
Sep 4, 2008 9:59:15 PM
They always blame the
dead guy. When my brother in law was killed in 91 in an F-16 mid air collision,
much like the one describe in this article, the Air Force blamed my dead
brother in law and the guy in the other plane lived and really had no serious
reprecussions.
It's a convenient way to close an accident report. I was an active duty E-8 at
the time and couldn't say much about it, but I see accident reports for what they
are; mainly political. Make the Air Force look as good as possible.
·
17267730
Sep 4, 2008 10:26:15 PM
How can the
investigators know the condition of the aircraft, at the time of the incident,
when both were destroyed? It seems the investigtors are spring loaded to say
"Pilot Error" when all the facts are not or cannot be exposed or
known. Give Mr. Hamilton a fair and lengthy chance to desscribe what happened,
then have some experienced F-15 pilots thoroughly sift through what is
available before concluding the case.
Thanks Col. John Gleason(USAF) ret
·
17473427
Sep 4, 2008 10:28:10 PM
Purplesuiter, seriosly
get some sort of clue!!
Sep 4, 2008 10:45:40 PM
Ummm first they are
called "inexperianced" then later on it is said they had excellant
qualifications? and 500 hours is qualified and 120 hours is still in training.
It was a screw up ie. Pilot Error!
·
E_C_Kemp
Sep 4, 2008 11:39:45 PM
Reynes said "They
were both competent and proficient
" How is that possible when the statement was made "The two pilots
missed critical training flights in the two months the fleet was grounded, yet
the investigative board could not conclude the missed training led to the crash
because both met all the qualifications to fly, Reynes said." Makes you
wonder who allows people to go play with planes. I think boys and girls that
the point is missed here. I have flown jets as an enlisted man. You just can
say someone os compitant of flying after being out of the seat for 2 months and
expect them to dog fight and nothing to happen. Nuff said
Edwin C. Kemp
NDT Level III
E & D Consulting Services
765-341-0029
·
15343953
Sep 5, 2008 2:59:02 AM
Flying is a dangerous
business. Accidents happen. For a news reproter to say that they were not
experienced enough is out of the question. If you are qualified to fly the
airframe, how can you be too inexperienced to fly a training mission? It
appears in your last paragraph, first line, you mispelled the word
"has". Does that mean you are not qualified to write? I do not claim
to be an expert when it comes to writing but that popped out at me.
Anyone who is flying an F-15 has passed the test to get into that airframe.
Unfortuanately, accidents happen. Don't try to make it out to seem that someone
was flying who shouldn't have been.
God bless both the pilots involved.
·
Jodcapes
Sep 5, 2008 7:34:05 AM
Yet another terrible and
avoidable air tragedy that can be traced back to the basic items of lack of
knowledge and skill. Just more examples of how the corporate structure of the
USAF has steered away from proper flying training for not only their
warfighters but all training to include technical training. When will
leadership get the message?
·
Aspen34
Sep 5, 2008 7:53:23 AM
Yes accidents happen.
From the SR71 world to AMC I've seen some crazy stuff. In the end, however,
most were and are professionals wanting to train to the max in preparation for
what we hope will never come to pass.
As a missile "cone head" type at one time, I hated the MPT but
couldn't tell the difference after an hour in it from the real capsule,
especially when you heard the dreaded, "you feel the capsule rocking and
rolling" and you were off and running to war!
Pilot friends tell me nothing is like the real jet, yet reality says
money/training time is tight.
Sr. leadership always has/will "push" those down below to the max, to
maximize capabilities. I've seen some great training people in my 20 plus yrs
and hope the tradition continues.
And for you young pilots out there just remember, fly the jet, stay in the
cockpit, press on!
Phil
Retired AF Capt
w/prior enlisted time
·
9082891
Sep 5, 2008 8:21:15 AM
I work in the squadron
with these two Eagle Drivers. And they are outstanding individuals and to say
such horrible things about them without personally knowing them is wrong. Yes,
it was an accident and we lost one life and two F-15C's. It sucks!!! Our Wing
has had a ton of grief over this situation. God bless all of our aviators
across the Military for undertaking such risk so we can have our freedom today!
Sep 5, 2008 10:04:44 AM